Whiting substitute??? by MWeber » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:49 pm. I've spent the morning driving around to local craft, art, hardware and paint stores looking for whiting (calcium carbonate?) to clean the glazing oil off my windows. Mostly just got blank stares. I can order it online but I have a freshly glazed 8 light sash to clean (first of many).The gulf kingfish, Menticirrhus littoralis, is the next most-common whiting caught in North Carolina waters. It is darker gray on its upper back and lightens to silver on its sides and belly and has no striping. The gulf kingfish is the largest of the species and grow to 3 pounds, ranging from Virginia, around the Gulf of Mexico, to Brazil. The ... Your Home for Home Projects. Signup to become a PaintPerks member. Save your favorite colors, photos, and past orders all in one place. With PaintPerks, you'll always be the first to hear about big sales and have access to everyday savings and exclusive offers.Whiting ( / ˈhwaɪtɪŋ / WHYTE-ing) is a city located in the Chicago Metropolitan Area in Lake County, Indiana, which was founded in 1889. The city is located on the southern shore of Lake Michigan. It is roughly 16 miles from the Chicago Loop and two miles from Chicago's South Side. Whiting is home to Whiting Refinery, the largest oil ... Capri Pizza in Whiting continues to serve the delicious goodness with some excellent specials to offer daily to customers. Recently opening the doors to yet another family run pizzeria, you can now also find the Savarino family hard at work in the suburbs of Joliet (Savarino Pizza; 1134 Jefferson in Shorewood, IL). Whiting's DoorAdjuster is designed to work with two-spring balancers equipped with either round or squared center shaft. Retrofit option for existing door systems. Retrofit Kit Options. Part# 20560COM-Winder Only. Part# 20560COM-2376 Style Balancer. Part# 20560COM-7176 Style Balance. Whiting Forensic Division in Middletown on Tuesday, Oct. 13, 2020. Some patients at the task force’s forum on Tuesday compared the hospital to a prison, and said Whiting’s conditions were ...Whiting ( / ˈhwaɪtɪŋ / WHYTE-ing) is a city located in the Chicago Metropolitan Area in Lake County, Indiana, which was founded in 1889. The city is located on the southern shore of Lake Michigan. It is roughly 16 miles from the Chicago Loop and two miles from Chicago's South Side. Whiting is home to Whiting Refinery, the largest oil ... The City of Whiting began purchasing potable water from the City of Hammond in June 2010 when we shut down our filtration plant. The department billing office is located in City Hall at 1443-119th Street. The Whiting Water Board meets with the Board of Public Works and Safety twice per month on the 1st and 3rd Tuesdays at 9:00AM.Habitat of the Whiting. These fish have relatively precise habitat preferences. They live primarily in demersal habitats, or habitats along the seafloor. Additionally, they prefer gravel or mud substrate, but also occupy areas with rocky or sandy bottoms. Most populations live at depths between 100 ft. and 328 ft. beneath the surface.Search Whiting family obituaries and memoriams on Legacy.com. There are 4084 obituaries and memoriams for the surname Whiting.The City of Whiting began purchasing potable water from the City of Hammond in June 2010 when we shut down our filtration plant. The department billing office is located in City Hall at 1443-119th Street. The Whiting Water Board meets with the Board of Public Works and Safety twice per month on the 1st and 3rd Tuesdays at 9:00AM. WHITING — With loud cheers and much confetti, the Mascot Hall of Fame Class of 2023 was unveiled Friday Night at the hall's annual Cue the Confetti Celebration and Fundraiser.Residents voice concerns after EPA proposes designating former Federated Metals property a Superfund site. From 2018 to 2019, the EPA remediated residential properties in Whiting and Hammond where ...Whiting are a silvery-colored fish with a mouth that turns downward. They are often confused with a very similar species—ground mullet. The body shapes are similar, but the ground mullet have more of a brown, mottled coloring. Whiting are much lighter in color and have a faint colored spot near the tail.Whiting & Davis is a renowned brand known for its exquisite metal mesh fashion accessories. From handbags to jewelry, the brand offers timeless pieces that are crafted with the highest quality materials. With a focus on modern elegance, Whiting & Davis is the perfect choice for those seeking a touch of sophistication. 1 hour ago · Residents voice concerns after EPA proposes designating former Federated Metals property a Superfund site. From 2018 to 2019, the EPA remediated residential properties in Whiting and Hammond where ... Jun 30, 2021 · Niacin, in whiting fish, may help reduce anxiety, depression, bipolar disorder, as well a host of mental derangement problems. [8] Whiting Fish vs Tilapia. While whiting fish and tilapia may look the same, there are a few key differences to understand before picking one for dinner. Tilapia may have a higher fat concentration than whiting fish. The gulf kingfish, Menticirrhus littoralis, is the next most-common whiting caught in North Carolina waters. It is darker gray on its upper back and lightens to silver on its sides and belly and has no striping. The gulf kingfish is the largest of the species and grow to 3 pounds, ranging from Virginia, around the Gulf of Mexico, to Brazil. The ... Jan 17, 2017 · Whiting fish facts. Whiting fish resembles the cod fish. It has small head, elongated body and pointed snout. It measures about 70 cm long with blue to green skin and silvery to white belly. It contains two anal fins and three dorsal fins. On the side, it has pectoral fins and pelvic fins are found near the gills. 1 hour ago · Residents voice concerns after EPA proposes designating former Federated Metals property a Superfund site. From 2018 to 2019, the EPA remediated residential properties in Whiting and Hammond where ... Whiting has 4 times less Vitamin B2 than Alaska pollock. Alaska pollock has 0.223mg of Vitamin B2, while Whiting has 0.06mg. Whiting contains less Sodium. Specific food types used in this comparison are Fish, pollock, Alaska, cooked, dry heat (may have been previously frozen) and Fish, whiting, mixed species, cooked, dry heat. 1. (animal) a. la pescadilla. (F) (de la familia de la merluza) Whiting isn't as expensive as hake.La pescadilla no es tan cara como la merluza. b. el merlán. (M) (de la familia del bacalao) Whiting is found in European waters.El merlán se encuentra en aguas europeas.Whiting City Hall is now open 8:00am - 4:00pm. Beginning Monday, April 18, 2022, we will be returning to our normal public access hours of 8:00am to 4:00pm. Visitors to City Hall may access the building via the side door only; the front doors will remain locked. For your convenience you may pay your utility bills using our online bill pay or by ...Whiting Rooster Dry Fly Saddles 1/4 Silver Grade. $47.00. Whiting Dry Fly Midge Saddles Silver Grade. $121.00. American Hen Saddle Black Laced. $32.00. Whiting Rooster Dry Fly Capes Silver Grade. $126.00. Whiting Hen Saddles.whiting, seasoning, granulated onion, cayenne pepper, lime, dried thyme and 5 more Fish Stew with Ginger and Tomatoes Simply Recipes flounder, chicken stock, sugar, whiting, white fish, haddock and 12 moreCurrent Name of facility: Complete Care at Whiting License number: 061534 Address: 3000 Hilltop Road, Whiting, New Jersey 08759 County: Ocean County Project Description: This project involves a Transfer of Ownership of the operations and real estate of Complete Care at Whiting from Complete Care at Whiting LLC to Whiting Gardens Intermittent clouds. RealFeel Shade™ 85°. Wind SSW 9 mph. Air Quality Fair. Max UV Index 3 Moderate. Wind Gusts 10 mph. Humidity 71%. Indoor Humidity 71% (Very Humid) Dew Point 71° F. Whiting - Fish Profile. The Whiting is one of the most frequently caught fish from the Florida surf and is often caught in inlets, bays and harbors. The whiting is popular because of its very lightly flavored white meat. Whiting average a little less than a pound but have been known to reach over two pounds. Very good!Find Whiting, NJ homes for sale, real estate, apartments, condos & townhomes with Coldwell Banker Realty. The Whiting Literary Magazine Prizes empower outstanding nonprofit publications to develop and implement ideas that will have a transformative impact and help sustain their crucial work as champions of writers. Up to eight prizes of $10k-$20k are awarded every three years to magazines that publish extraordinary writing, support talented writers ...8 hours ago · Whiting’s Joe Quiroz is ‘just a different man’ in his 2nd season after missing 2 years. Whiting senior linebacker Joe Quiroz is a team captain in his second season after sitting out during ... Niacin, in whiting fish, may help reduce anxiety, depression, bipolar disorder, as well a host of mental derangement problems. [8] Whiting Fish vs Tilapia. While whiting fish and tilapia may look the same, there are a few key differences to understand before picking one for dinner. Tilapia may have a higher fat concentration than whiting fish.Find Whiting, NJ homes for sale, real estate, apartments, condos & townhomes with Coldwell Banker Realty. Whiting Ranch Wilderness Park Supervising Ranger Candi Hubert stands by the temporarily closed entrance to the park in Foothill Ranch on Wednesday, March 3, 2021. The park remains closed due to an ...Dr. Alexander C. Whiting is a Neurosurgeon in Pittsburgh, PA. Find Dr. Whiting's phone number, address, hospital affiliations and more. Whiting, 325 Calcium Carbonate. Buy in monthly payments with Affirm on orders over $50. Learn more. Priced per pound. Quantity discounts are available. Whiting is the commonly-used name for calcium carbonate (CaCO 3 ), which is the most common source of calcium in glazes. It is a high temperature flux which gives durability and hardness to glazes.Whiting Rooster Dry Fly Saddles 1/4 Silver Grade. $47.00. Whiting Dry Fly Midge Saddles Silver Grade. $121.00. American Hen Saddle Black Laced. $32.00. Whiting Rooster Dry Fly Capes Silver Grade. $126.00. Whiting Hen Saddles.The City of Whiting began purchasing potable water from the City of Hammond in June 2010 when we shut down our filtration plant. The department billing office is located in City Hall at 1443-119th Street. The Whiting Water Board meets with the Board of Public Works and Safety twice per month on the 1st and 3rd Tuesdays at 9:00AM.Sep 1, 2023 · 2023 Household Hazardous Waste Collection Schedule for WHITING. On Saturday, August 19, 2023, the Lake County Solid Waste Management Hazardous Waste Collection will take place at the Whiting Public Works Facility located at 1915 Front St., Whiting, IN from 9:00am to 2:00pm. Read More. Residents voice concerns after EPA proposes designating former Federated Metals property a Superfund site. From 2018 to 2019, the EPA remediated residential properties in Whiting and Hammond where ...Hopkins Engineering News. Faculty from Whiting and Dublin City University will collaborate on developing best practices for online and blended teaching and learning. The endowed headship was established in 2021 through the generosity of the estate of Louis (Lou) M. Sardella. Achievement could provide a clearer picture of the role the chromosome ...May 18, 2023 · The whiting fishery in the United States operates from Maine to Cape Hatteras, North Carolina. Along with red hake, whiting are part of the small-mesh multispecies fishery, which is managed primarily through a series of exemptions from the Northeast Multispecies Fishery Management Plan (or groundfish fishery). The directed commercial fishery is ... The Whiting is named in memory of James H. Whiting, an early pioneer of the auto industry and one of the founders of Flint Wagon Works in 1882. He was made President of Flint Wagon Works and in 1903 convinced his partners to buy the Buick Motor Car Company in Detroit and move it to Flint. Whiting became President while David Buick was General ... Sep 1, 2023 · 2023 Household Hazardous Waste Collection Schedule for WHITING. On Saturday, August 19, 2023, the Lake County Solid Waste Management Hazardous Waste Collection will take place at the Whiting Public Works Facility located at 1915 Front St., Whiting, IN from 9:00am to 2:00pm. Read More. Whiting’s Joe Quiroz is ‘just a different man’ in his 2nd season after missing 2 years. Whiting senior linebacker Joe Quiroz is a team captain in his second season after sitting out during ...Sam Whiting has been a staff writer at The San Francisco Chronicle since 1988. He started as a feature writer in the People section, which was anchored by Herb Caen's column, and has written about ...Whiting has 4 times less Vitamin B2 than Alaska pollock. Alaska pollock has 0.223mg of Vitamin B2, while Whiting has 0.06mg. Whiting contains less Sodium. Specific food types used in this comparison are Fish, pollock, Alaska, cooked, dry heat (may have been previously frozen) and Fish, whiting, mixed species, cooked, dry heat. Small silvery fish with tender, white, firm flesh, delicately flavoured and low in fat. Whiting is related to cod but is slightly cheaper and less flavoursome. They are a good buy in their own right, however, for certain recipes, especially fish pates and mousse. Jul 14, 2012 · Whiting substitute??? by MWeber » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:49 pm. I've spent the morning driving around to local craft, art, hardware and paint stores looking for whiting (calcium carbonate?) to clean the glazing oil off my windows. Mostly just got blank stares. I can order it online but I have a freshly glazed 8 light sash to clean (first of many). 1 hour ago · Residents voice concerns after EPA proposes designating former Federated Metals property a Superfund site. From 2018 to 2019, the EPA remediated residential properties in Whiting and Hammond where ... Feb 10, 2020 · The Glory Days of Whiting. A look back at the silver hake fishery that once existed off New Jersey. by Milt Rosko February 10, 2020. Pictured above: It often got crowded at Long Branch Pier, with whiting anglers two and three deep along the rail. It was a chilly November Friday, with the wind out of the northwest, as I stood outside Lincoln ... Specialties: Whiting Iron is a local family business serving the Phoenix metro area since 2002, providing the best in beautiful, custom-designed ironwork products. Established in 1999. Great Gates Inc. is a local family business serving the Phoenix valley for the past 15 years.Dec 2, 2019 · In a medium bowl, combine the cornmeal, cayenne pepper, all-purpose flour, salt and pepper to taste, and basil. Mix well and set aside. Wash and lightly season the fish with salt and pepper. Set aside. Coat each fish one by one and set aside on a plate. Then fry the fish in small batches for 5 minutes per side. City Meeting Dates. Board of Public Works and Safety. 1 st and 3 rd Tuesdays @ 9:00am. Council Chamber. Common Council. 1 st and 3 rd Tuesdays @ 6:30pm. Council Chamber. Sanitary Board of Commissioners. 1 st Tuesday @ 5:00pm.Whiting - Fish Profile. The Whiting is one of the most frequently caught fish from the Florida surf and is often caught in inlets, bays and harbors. The whiting is popular because of its very lightly flavored white meat. Whiting average a little less than a pound but have been known to reach over two pounds. Very good!Whiting claims to have found religion in 1995 while serving his life term. He wrote more than a dozen religious pieces for “Between the Bars,” a blog platform established for prison inmates.Jan 19, 2021 · Flip the pieces and cook them for another 2 to 3 minutes. Use your tongs to flip each piece of fish over. Set a timer for another 2 to 3 minutes, then take the fish off when they start steaming. Whiting are very thin, so they’ll start to get crispy right away. 4. Transfer the fish to a plate before serving. Welcome to Whiting Farms. hiting Farms was founded in 1989 by Dr. Tom Whiting with the goal of producing the highest quality, value and selection of feathers for the fly tiers of the world. It was with this goal in mind that Dr. Tom’s work began by acquiring the finest breeding stock in the world, Hoffman hackle, and soon thereafter, Hebert ...Current Name of facility: Complete Care at Whiting License number: 061534 Address: 3000 Hilltop Road, Whiting, New Jersey 08759 County: Ocean County Project Description: This project involves a Transfer of Ownership of the operations and real estate of Complete Care at Whiting from Complete Care at Whiting LLC to Whiting Gardens Welcome to Whiting Farms. hiting Farms was founded in 1989 by Dr. Tom Whiting with the goal of producing the highest quality, value and selection of feathers for the fly tiers of the world. It was with this goal in mind that Dr. Tom’s work began by acquiring the finest breeding stock in the world, Hoffman hackle, and soon thereafter, Hebert ...Stephen Newman Whiting (born September 14, 1967) is a United States Space Force lieutenant general who serves as the first and current commander of Space Operations Command. He previously served as the deputy commander of Air Force Space Command . Whiting-Turner is a career-oriented company whose commitment to promotion from within has resulted in successful and significant geographic expansion. Individuals who seek opportunity and additional responsibility are recognized and rewarded. Graduates can elect to be either a field engineer on a path to superintendent or a project engineer on ...1 day ago · The “First Annual Whiting Mills Spooktacular” is set to take place at the historic Whiting Mills in Winsted from 11 a.m. to 4 p.m. on Saturday, Oct. 7. Several activities and prizes will be ... Reduce the heat to a minimum and cook for eight minutes. Be very careful of the milk reaching a boil and suddenly rising to overflow the pot. Turn the heat off and remove the whiting with a slotted spoon to a plate, discarding the bay leaf. Cover and allow to cool. Melt 2oz only of the butter in a clean saucepan. WHITING — With loud cheers and much confetti, the Mascot Hall of Fame Class of 2023 was unveiled Friday Night at the hall's annual Cue the Confetti Celebration and Fundraiser.Stephen Newman Whiting (born September 14, 1967) is a United States Space Force lieutenant general who serves as the first and current commander of Space Operations Command. He previously served as the deputy commander of Air Force Space Command . Explore Whiting in Uinta-Wasatch-Cache National Forest, Utah with Recreation.gov. Whiting Campground is located in Maple Canyon, just 3 miles from the town of Mapleton, Utah, at an elevation of 5,400 feet.Whiting - Fish Profile. The Whiting is one of the most frequently caught fish from the Florida surf and is often caught in inlets, bays and harbors. The whiting is popular because of its very lightly flavored white meat. Whiting average a little less than a pound but have been known to reach over two pounds. Very good! All Obituaries - Whiting's Funeral Home offers a variety of funeral services, from traditional funerals to competitively priced cremations, serving Williamsburg, VA and the surrounding communities. We also offer funeral pre-planning and carry a wide selection of caskets, vaults, urns and burial containers.Find Whiting, NJ homes for sale, real estate, apartments, condos & townhomes with Coldwell Banker Realty.Whiting's DoorAdjuster is designed to work with two-spring balancers equipped with either round or squared center shaft. Retrofit option for existing door systems. Retrofit Kit Options. Part# 20560COM-Winder Only. Part# 20560COM-2376 Style Balancer. Part# 20560COM-7176 Style Balance. Merlangus linnei Malm, 1877. Merlangius merlangus, commonly known as whiting or merling, is an important food fish in the eastern North Atlantic Ocean and the northern Mediterranean, western Baltic, and Black Sea. In Anglophonic countries outside the Whiting's natural range, the name "whiting" has been applied to various other species of fish .Dr. Alexander C. Whiting is a Neurosurgeon in Pittsburgh, PA. Find Dr. Whiting's phone number, address, hospital affiliations and more. Welcome to Whiting Farms. hiting Farms was founded in 1989 by Dr. Tom Whiting with the goal of producing the highest quality, value and selection of feathers for the fly tiers of the world. It was with this goal in mind that Dr. Tom’s work began by acquiring the finest breeding stock in the world, Hoffman hackle, and soon thereafter, Hebert ... 1 hour ago · Residents voice concerns after EPA proposes designating former Federated Metals property a Superfund site. From 2018 to 2019, the EPA remediated residential properties in Whiting and Hammond where ... Whiting fish facts. Whiting fish resembles the cod fish. It has small head, elongated body and pointed snout. It measures about 70 cm long with blue to green skin and silvery to white belly. It contains two anal fins and three dorsal fins. On the side, it has pectoral fins and pelvic fins are found near the gills.Whiting-Turner is a career-oriented company whose commitment to promotion from within has resulted in successful and significant geographic expansion. Individuals who seek opportunity and additional responsibility are recognized and rewarded. Graduates can elect to be either a field engineer on a path to superintendent or a project engineer on ...Kindle Edition. $499. This title will be released on January 2, 2024. Pre-order with 1-Click ®.
WHITING — With loud cheers and much confetti, the Mascot Hall of Fame Class of 2023 was unveiled Friday Night at the hall's annual Cue the Confetti Celebration and Fundraiser.. Auto mataru
Whiting ( / ˈhwaɪtɪŋ / WHYTE-ing) is a city located in the Chicago Metropolitan Area in Lake County, Indiana, which was founded in 1889. The city is located on the southern shore of Lake Michigan. It is roughly 16 miles from the Chicago Loop and two miles from Chicago's South Side. Whiting is home to Whiting Refinery, the largest oil ...Capri Pizza in Whiting continues to serve the delicious goodness with some excellent specials to offer daily to customers. Recently opening the doors to yet another family run pizzeria, you can now also find the Savarino family hard at work in the suburbs of Joliet (Savarino Pizza; 1134 Jefferson in Shorewood, IL). 46-27 (W) Whiting vs. Osceola Grace Eagles. On 8/18, the Whiting varsity football team won their home non-conference game against Osceola Grace Eagles (Osceola, IN) by a score of 46-27. Whiting 46.whiting: [noun] any of various marine food fishes: such as. a common European fish (Merlangius merlangus) of the cod family. silver hake.whiting: [noun] any of various marine food fishes: such as. a common European fish (Merlangius merlangus) of the cod family. silver hake.Whiting - Fish Profile. The Whiting is one of the most frequently caught fish from the Florida surf and is often caught in inlets, bays and harbors. The whiting is popular because of its very lightly flavored white meat. Whiting average a little less than a pound but have been known to reach over two pounds. Very good!Whiting ( / ˈhwaɪtɪŋ / WHYTE-ing) is a city located in the Chicago Metropolitan Area in Lake County, Indiana, which was founded in 1889. The city is located on the southern shore of Lake Michigan. It is roughly 16 miles from the Chicago Loop and two miles from Chicago's South Side. Whiting is home to Whiting Refinery, the largest oil ...Whiting are a silvery-colored fish with a mouth that turns downward. They are often confused with a very similar species—ground mullet. The body shapes are similar, but the ground mullet have more of a brown, mottled coloring. Whiting are much lighter in color and have a faint colored spot near the tail.The Whiting True Green™* is a McMurray Hatchery exclusive. These are excellent green egg layers. This popular chicken breed is known for laying consistently large, green eggs. Whiting True Greens have an astounding feed-to-egg conversion, are not likely to set, and free range well. Mature birds range from reddish to chestnut in color, have a ...WHITING — With loud cheers and much confetti, the Mascot Hall of Fame Class of 2023 was unveiled Friday Night at the hall's annual Cue the Confetti Celebration and Fundraiser. Major funding for the Flint Institute of Music is provided by Charles Stewart Mott Foundation. Learn more at mott.org. This program and/or service is funded in whole or in part by the Genesee County Arts Education and Cultural Enrichment Millage funds. Your tax dollars are at work.Whiting ( / ˈhwaɪtɪŋ / WHYTE-ing) is a city located in the Chicago Metropolitan Area in Lake County, Indiana, which was founded in 1889. The city is located on the southern shore of Lake Michigan. It is roughly 16 miles from the Chicago Loop and two miles from Chicago's South Side. Whiting is home to Whiting Refinery, the largest oil ... Whiting-Turner is a career-oriented company whose commitment to promotion from within has resulted in successful and significant geographic expansion. Individuals who seek opportunity and additional responsibility are recognized and rewarded. Graduates can elect to be either a field engineer on a path to superintendent or a project engineer on ...In a medium bowl, combine the cornmeal, cayenne pepper, all-purpose flour, salt and pepper to taste, and basil. Mix well and set aside. Wash and lightly season the fish with salt and pepper. Set aside. Coat each fish one by one and set aside on a plate. Then fry the fish in small batches for 5 minutes per side.Whiting substitute??? by MWeber » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:49 pm. I've spent the morning driving around to local craft, art, hardware and paint stores looking for whiting (calcium carbonate?) to clean the glazing oil off my windows. Mostly just got blank stares. I can order it online but I have a freshly glazed 8 light sash to clean (first of many).Whiting Forensic Division in Middletown on Tuesday, Oct. 13, 2020. Some patients at the task force’s forum on Tuesday compared the hospital to a prison, and said Whiting’s conditions were ...The Whiting True Green™* is a McMurray Hatchery exclusive. These are excellent green egg layers. This popular chicken breed is known for laying consistently large, green eggs. Whiting True Greens have an astounding feed-to-egg conversion, are not likely to set, and free range well. Mature birds range from reddish to chestnut in color, have a ... Aug 29, 2023 · Whiting definition: A whiting is a black and silver fish that lives in the sea. | Meaning, pronunciation, translations and examples Whiting is a city located in the Chicago Metropolitan Area in Lake County, Indiana, which was founded in 1889. The city is located on the southern shore of Lake Michigan. It is roughly 16 miles from the Chicago Loop and just short of two miles from Chicago's South Side. Whiting is home to Whiting Refinery, the largest oil refinery in the Midwest. Set aside. In a large bowl or shallow plate, combine the flours and all the seasonings. Or if it's easier add the flour and cornmeal to a bowl first whisk to combine then pour it on a shallow plate. Dredge both sides of the whiting in the breading mixture. Place the fish on a large parchment paper lined baking sheet or pan..